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Old 01-02-2011, 03:33 PM   #21
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

Quote:
Originally Posted by emmbeedee View Post
New member here!

I stumbled on this site while trying to fix my wife's 2009 KLX250S, which was very reluctant to start even after I had modded the carb with a larger pilot jet, and drilled out the pilot screw adjuster. I had also put the KLX300 snorkle on the bike.

All the changes above made the bike run better, but only if we could start it.

In the last couple of days I've tried starting the bike and it flatly refused to fire, let alone start so I decided I'd had enough.

I took the carb right off and checked the level of the float and it was set to 14mm so I reset it to 13mm, effectively raising the fuel level in the bowl, and reassembled it on the bike.

It still wouldn't fire up so I pulled the plug and it looked wet so I gave it a burn on the propane torch to get the wetness off, and next time I tried it started right up.

The engine sounds like it's running better now with the higher level of fuel. Before the bike would sputter and stall if you slowed down until it was well and truly warmed up, but now it just sits there idling nicely once I take it off the choke.

I'm not putting the plastics back on until I've proven it can be started from bone cold, but the results are encouraging so far.

Mike
The starter jet on all KLX250's from '06-'10 is on the extremely small side. These are brass, pressed-in jets, so you have to drill them instead of replacing. This is a very common ill on the KLX250S. Oddly not all bikes need this, but many do. If you drill that starter jet out to .018", the cold starting issue is gone. You can read a lot more about this with a search on the Kawasaki Forums under the dual sport, KLX250S section. Very common problem.
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Old 01-02-2011, 03:54 PM   #22
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

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Originally Posted by TNC View Post
The starter jet on all KLX250's from '06-'10 is on the extremely small side. These are brass, pressed-in jets, so you have to drill them instead of replacing. This is a very common ill on the KLX250S. Oddly not all bikes need this, but many do. If you drill that starter jet out to .018", the cold starting issue is gone. You can read a lot more about this with a search on the Kawasaki Forums under the dual sport, KLX250S section. Very common problem.
I read that, but since I didn't have the right drill bit, and I prefer to make one change at a time, I went ahead with the float height mod and it seems to work well for this bike, anyway.

I went out after an hour and hardly needed the choke, which is very unusual for this bike. Normally if you let the bike sit for 1/2 an hour it'll crank for 20 seconds then starts firing but not start for another 20 seconds of cranking.

The temps are -3C right now, so I was amazed that it started so easily. And it hardly stalls at all whereas it used to stall all the time before.

But if this is not the cure, I'll be sure to invest in the right drill bit for the next time I work on it.
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Old 01-02-2011, 07:55 PM   #23
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

Finally drilled the starter jet and it seems to have fixed it!!!!!!! It starts as good or better than the 650 now. Thanks guys!! I haven't actually waited longer than a few days to start it because I've been on vacation and riding more. However it does start much easier. And it's been in the teens and snowing so I've very hopeful. I used vise grips to turn the bit and it only took 10 or 15 turns to go through. Simple and easy!

Perhaps the key to some needing the jet drilled and some don't is the float level. I suspect mine is low, but the dealer stripped the drain screw so I wasn't able to check the level. Perhaps, if the float level is on the low side the starter jet can't pull as much fuel and therefore creates the lean condition in the enriching circuit.
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Last edited by DS Cowboy; 01-02-2011 at 08:01 PM.
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Old 01-02-2011, 08:20 PM   #24
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

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Originally Posted by Buz Lityr View Post
if the float level is on the low side the starter jet can't pull as much fuel and therefore creates the lean condition in the enriching circuit.
Mythbusters would say that is at least a Plausible relationship!

Glad you followed TNC's direction and fixed the actual problem: too small of a hole in that starter jet.
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Old 01-03-2011, 12:55 AM   #25
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

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Originally Posted by Buz Lityr View Post
Finally drilled the starter jet and it seems to have fixed it!!!!!!! It starts as good or better than the 650 now. Thanks guys!! I haven't actually waited longer than a few days to start it because I've been on vacation and riding more. However it does start much easier. And it's been in the teens and snowing so I've very hopeful. I used vise grips to turn the bit and it only took 10 or 15 turns to go through. Simple and easy!

Perhaps the key to some needing the jet drilled and some don't is the float level. I suspect mine is low, but the dealer stripped the drain screw so I wasn't able to check the level. Perhaps, if the float level is on the low side the starter jet can't pull as much fuel and therefore creates the lean condition in the enriching circuit.
Nope, not the fuel or float level. It's a logical guess, but I had my float set by the clear tube method that shows actual fuel level against the outside of the float bowl, and it was dead-bang-on-the-spot...still had the cold start blues until I drilled the starter jet. It is a bit of a mystery why not all of the bikes have this issue. I've seen this issue a few times in the past when I worked part time at a shop as a mechanic. The '78 or '79 KZ650 4-cylinder was a model where many had the cold start issue, but not everyone. Drilling the starter jets in 4 carbs was a PITA, but it solved the issue.
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Old 01-03-2011, 01:41 PM   #26
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

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Originally Posted by TNC View Post
Nope, not the fuel or float level. It's a logical guess, but I had my float set by the clear tube method that shows actual fuel level against the outside of the float bowl, and it was dead-bang-on-the-spot...still had the cold start blues until I drilled the starter jet. It is a bit of a mystery why not all of the bikes have this issue. I've seen this issue a few times in the past when I worked part time at a shop as a mechanic. The '78 or '79 KZ650 4-cylinder was a model where many had the cold start issue, but not everyone. Drilling the starter jets in 4 carbs was a PITA, but it solved the issue.
Guess you might have something there. The bike fires but is still reluctant to start today, so next step is to drill out the "starter jet". Is that the tiny hole just on the engine side of the butterfly valve?

How do you find a .018 drill bit? None of the places I tried today had them. Smallest I could find is 1/16" which would be far too big.
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Old 01-03-2011, 02:42 PM   #27
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

emmbeedee
You will probably have to order it. I did a google search for .018 drill bit and found it. Another "name" is #77 drill bit. I found a few local hobby shops that had small bits but none had that size.

TNC
If not the float level then perhaps the amount of the opening created by pulling the choke lever. Maybe there is a variance in how far the plunger opens to alow the air flow and vacuum. Who knows!! It's fixed though!!! I really appreciate all the knowledge sharing on this forum. Thanks.
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Old 01-03-2011, 02:50 PM   #28
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

Quote:
Originally Posted by Buz Lityr View Post
emmbeedee
You will probably have to order it. I did a google search for .018 drill bit and found it. Another "name" is #77 drill bit. I found a few local hobby shops that had small bits but none had that size.
Is this the starter jet?

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Old 01-03-2011, 04:06 PM   #29
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

Yep. Here's TNC's advice (in part) to me:

"don't use a powered drill. The bits in this size range are too small. They are designed to be turned by hand, preferably in a small hand held bit holder. However, some guys have just stuck the bit in a pair of vise grips with equal success. The brass cuts easily, and you can tell when you've gone through the jet and the bit touches the pot metal of the carb. Yes, hold the carb in its upright position. Most of the brass flecks will fall down and out, but a couple of good shots of compressed air or even some pressured carb cleaner in a can will work. Before you drill, spray some carb cleaner, brake cleaner, or something into the starter jet, and you can see where it comes out. Where it comes out is where you'll spray the air or carb cleaner to clear out any brass residue. Does that make sense?"

The only thing I can add is be sure you have the choke lever pulled all the way open before you spray the cleaner in to see where it comes out. Otherwise you will get a face full of cleaner. Ask me how I know... That was a duh huh moment!
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Old 01-03-2011, 04:20 PM   #30
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

Quote:
Originally Posted by Buz Lityr View Post
Yep. Here's TNC's advice (in part) to me:...
Thank to you and TNC!

I've ordered some bits. May need to buy 5, but not a big problem.
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Old 01-03-2011, 07:28 PM   #31
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

Another thing I found annoying with the carb on the KLX is that the drain screw is small, and at an awkward angle so I dremeled a slot in the head and soldered on a small flat washer, to make it easier to use without tools.

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Old 01-05-2011, 06:56 PM   #32
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

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Originally Posted by emmbeedee View Post
Thanks to you and TNC!

I've ordered some bits. May need to buy 5, but not a big problem.
Actually I have to buy a dozen at $1.85 each, unfortunately. Maybe I'll start a mail order .018 drill bit service. ;)
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Old 01-14-2011, 06:02 PM   #33
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

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Originally Posted by emmbeedee View Post
Actually I have to buy a dozen at $1.85 each, unfortunately. Maybe I'll start a mail order .018 drill bit service. ;)
So the drill bits arrived today. I feel like a giant!



This is what I used to drill the jet out.




When I was picking up the bits I also picked up a bunch of M4 X 20 Stainless Allen head machine screws to replace the cheesehead screws on the float bowl. What crap those original screws are. It's like they strip the heads on them from the factory.
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Old 01-14-2011, 08:26 PM   #34
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

Yep. The allen screws are much better. I ordered the replacement screws when I got the jets and needle for the 650. Didn't do the 250 because I didn't have to order anything to do the mod. They will eventually get replaced though. Good luck!
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Old 01-14-2011, 11:36 PM   #35
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

Greetings, My wife's klx250s displays all of the starting problems described on this thread. I too have done the Dyno Jet kit, float level, float needle, and of course the bike on her side trick.
My hat is off to ya'll for a simple and clearly illustrated solution

Thank you,
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Old 01-22-2011, 04:51 PM   #36
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

Hello all,
Well I found several #77 bits and pulled the carb to do the described fix. Then guess what, no drilling was necessary because the bit slid right through the oriface and I almost lost it. As this was a new 2010 factory fresh bike I guess Kawasaki already made that change.
The logic of this fix makes perfect sense, however, there must be another cause of the problem. One change I made was to seal the threads with grease on the enrichener housing just in case there was an air leak there(doubtful).
Before I reassemble any other ideas besides the obvious and the already posted?
Thanks,
steelhorse
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Old 01-23-2011, 09:06 AM   #37
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

I haven't a clue where to go next. I know someone will chime in soon. Did you notice if the bike was lean when trying to start before you pulled the carb? When I started this, I pulled the plug and spun the engine over with my finger over the hole to feel the compression and to see if there was any sign of fuel. I found good compression but not even a smell of fuel. And always a dry plug. If yours is the same we know a lean condition is the cause and we just have to look for reasons. I just don't want to assume it's the same because the symptoms appear the same.
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Old 01-23-2011, 11:06 AM   #38
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

Morning all,
Thanks BUZ for the reply. I have noticed a "dry" plug and was expecting a "wet" one. (That's the old 2 stroke days talking). Good catch Buz.
1. I "mic'd" the bits, 0.018"
2. I removed the enrichener/housing and forced air through the jet. clear passage.
3. As mentioned I grease sealed the housing threads.
4. Even though I do not have jetting issues once the engine is running, I removed the "pilot jet" and again, clear passage.(did notice how small the oriface was and just to compare I placed the shank end of the #77 bit into the jet and it would not fit. I was expecting it to be larger than the starting jet.)
5. After my last post I found another thread here you might want to read. (I think it is next to this thread.) They discuss this issue (hard cold start) with a surprising twist. Read and make your own decisions.
6. I'm going to reassemble this afternoon and hope for the best.
Good Luck,
steelhorse
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Old 04-12-2011, 07:12 PM   #39
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Default Re: 09 klx250s carb tube

Well it's been a long time since I posted about our hard starting KLX, but it's now starting as easily as my fuel injected BMW! And that says a lot.

The fuel was stale so I initially still had some problems getting it going until I realized why that might be, so as soon as I put fresh gas into it, it immediately started and settled down to a nice steady idle after about 30 seconds of choke.

The temperature was still only about +3 C at that point so I can't say that warmer weather was necessarily the cure, but I'm sure it helps a little. The bike was always a reluctant starter, from new, sometimes needing choke for the first 10 minutes before I could turn it off and not have the bike die.

So now the bike has plenty of grunt down low and does not stall, no matter how low I let it go, and my wife whose bike this is is very happy with it.

Thanks everyone for the help!

Last edited by emmbeedee; 04-12-2011 at 07:15 PM.
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