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Old 04-23-2010, 09:55 PM   #41
wymanwinn
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

sorry guys, i stand by my guns...running less than 2.5 liters MAY, i say MAY cause a lack of "splash" oiling of the upper balancer bearings...

oh yeah...i have split the cases of TWO KLRs with bad upper bearings...ya never know...

instill 2.5 liters, cover the sight glass at vertical...you are good to go...

JMHO mind you...do what ya like...splitting cases for $10 worth of bearings is stoooopid (yes 4 Os)...

i do lots of KLR work for NO LABOR...not splitting cases though...

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Old 04-24-2010, 11:39 AM   #42
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

This is really great info. I had noticed the full sight glass effect when adding 2.5 liters. Glad to know that I wasn't screwing up. Now I can say that "I do it the way Wyman does it."
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Old 04-24-2010, 12:39 PM   #43
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by willys View Post
Although I did manage to strip the hole enough that I can't trust it to be able to get it off again if I tighten it down too much again....DAMN!!!!
Don't worry, willys!

If you strip the threads, an OVERSIZE OIL FILLER CAP is in the works . . .

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Old 04-25-2010, 09:00 PM   #44
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by wymanwinn View Post
sorry guys, i stand by my guns...running less than 2.5 liters MAY, i say MAY cause a lack of "splash" oiling of the upper balancer bearings...

oh yeah...i have split the cases of TWO KLRs with bad upper bearings...ya never know...

instill 2.5 liters, cover the sight glass at vertical...you are good to go...

JMHO mind you...do what ya like...splitting cases for $10 worth of bearings is stoooopid (yes 4 Os)...

i do lots of KLR work for NO LABOR...not splitting cases though...

wyman
Good for you, you should, your research seems spot on to me. As for the naysayers, at what point does low oil harm a motor, and how much is too much for overfill?
I submit that a little too much does no harm, but at one point or another, a little too low has great potential to do great damage.
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Old 04-25-2010, 11:45 PM   #45
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

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. . . at what point does low oil harm a motor, and how much is too much for overfill?
My impression, reckless perhaps, but . . . unless over-filling causes hydrostatic lock, I think the engine will puke out the excess without damage ('though the manual says syringe-out excess oil when over-filled); and . . . as long as oil pressure is maintained, and engine oil temperature stabilized within safe limits . . . I'd think the oil quantity would allow you to "make it throught the night," although WyamanWinn's observation of bad upper bearings may be a consequence of under-filling. How MUCH underfilling? Beyond the lower mark on the sight glass, I'd imagine.
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Old 04-26-2010, 09:19 PM   #46
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

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Originally Posted by XDragRacer View Post
My impression, reckless perhaps, but . . . unless over-filling causes hydrostatic lock, I think the engine will puke out the excess without damage ('though the manual says syringe-out excess oil when over-filled); and . . . as long as oil pressure is maintained, and engine oil temperature stabilized within safe limits . . . I'd think the oil quantity would allow you to "make it throught the night," although WyamanWinn's observation of bad upper bearings may be a consequence of under-filling. How MUCH underfilling? Beyond the lower mark on the sight glass, I'd imagine.
XDragRacer, ever try to "syringe-out" the EXCESS? Can't get a WET noodle past the clutch! Best to just pull the drain plug and let it DROOL on your hand as you watch for small bubble at top of window, I jokeingly suggest. JUST LEAVE IT OVER FULL. It will either burn it or puke it. IT WON'T HURT IT!!!!!!!! pdwestman.
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Old 04-26-2010, 09:33 PM   #47
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

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XDragRacer, ever try to "syringe-out" the EXCESS? Can't get a WET noodle past the clutch! Best to just pull the drain plug and let it DROOL on your hand as you watch for small bubble at top of window, I jokeingly suggest. JUST LEAVE IT OVER FULL. It will either burn it or puke it. IT WON'T HURT IT!!!!!!!! pdwestman.
Don't shoot the messenger, pdwesman; the MANUAL says to syringe or siphon out the extra oil, not I!

Never tried it, but . . . I'd think a thin, flexible hose might make it down into the sump, yet . . . I'm inclined to go along with your notion . . . short of hydrostatic lock, I don't think excess oil a serious problem!

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Old 04-27-2010, 09:19 AM   #48
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

Wyman, thanks for the great article! I've been using the sight glass and keeping the oil between the lines. Apparently this has left me low anywhere from a 1/2 to a full liter. My '09 has started burning oil. I guess I need to keep the level at the top of the glass or risk running low.
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Old 04-27-2010, 09:39 AM   #49
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

I have always kept the oil level at the top of the sight glass....just so that there isn't any air visible in the glass......that way when you take a quick look it is immediately obvious if you see any air....oil has disappeared....adding too much risks getting it blown into the airbox....no? IMHO.

Again...this is all to personal preferance...as usual....
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Old 04-27-2010, 09:48 AM   #50
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

Quote:
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I have always kept the oil level at the top of the sight glass....just so that there isn't any air visible in the glass......that way when you take a quick look it is immediately obvious if you see any air....oil has disappeared....adding too much risks getting it blown into the airbox....no? IMHO.

Again...this is all to personal preferance...as usual....

Morning Willy,

That's my new plan. The old plan was keeping the oil between the 2 lines in the sight glass. It wouldn't be a problem if it didn't burn oil.
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Old 04-27-2010, 10:07 AM   #51
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

685 time.....go get it!
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Old 04-27-2010, 10:18 AM   #52
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

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Originally Posted by willys View Post
685 time.....go get it!
At the moment, I'm leaning towards letting the next owner deal with this problem. I like the KLR package, but have little or no desire to tear apart the engine to resolve this problem. I'm not that patient of a person to completely tear it down, have it bored out, and put it back together. As I've said before, it would take me weeks and it still might not be fully working after that.

So today the answer is ride with a quart of oil in the tail bag and check the level at every fill up.

Although, more power would be nice (I assume you get that with the 685 as well)...
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Old 04-27-2010, 10:30 AM   #53
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

Yes there is but most people enjoy the lack of vibes more than the power increase.
Wyman lives close to you doesn't he? That would be a day's job not weeks if you make the journey. Well worth it IMHO. Not from just a farkle nut or a power hungry lunatic....but just as a maintenance feak.
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Old 04-27-2010, 11:43 AM   #54
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

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Yes there is but most people enjoy the lack of vibes more than the power increase.
Wyman lives close to you doesn't he? That would be a day's job not weeks if you make the journey. Well worth it IMHO. Not from just a farkle nut or a power hungry lunatic....but just as a maintenance feak.
According to Google maps, its 1,530 miles from my house to Solvang, CA - where his profile says is his home. Still likely worth it to make the drive instead of blindly tackling this myself. There are other guru's here closer (Wyman might be the guru's guru) but this is still an involved job, to say the least. And not cheap. $400 for the kit, $100 for the bore job, $125 for the Doo (might as well do this will we have the motor apart), and any other tweaking we should do while were at it.
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Old 04-27-2010, 12:26 PM   #55
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

$243 plus head gasket.....not $400...?
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Old 04-27-2010, 12:34 PM   #56
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

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$243 plus head gasket.....not $400...?
My bad, $300 (includes gasket and shipping, etc)
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Old 04-27-2010, 01:14 PM   #57
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

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My bad, $300 (includes gasket and shipping, etc)
complete kit (bored/honed exchange cylinder, piston kit with rings gapped, 2pc head/.010base/exhaust/cam chain tension gaskets, Loctite 515 for the base gasket...shipped CONUS for $425...you send your cylinder first...i ship the kit...Canada add $10 for extra shipping...

if done in my garage add for or bring coolant/oil/filter...about $20

685 installation takes about 4 hours in my garage...a bit more if i need to fix burned/pitted valves...i leak test EVERY head...

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Old 04-27-2010, 03:47 PM   #58
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

Thanks! i need to go add some oil!
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Old 04-29-2010, 04:50 PM   #59
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by wymanwinn View Post
complete kit (bored/honed exchange cylinder, piston kit with rings gapped, 2pc head/.010base/exhaust/cam chain tension gaskets, Loctite 515 for the base gasket...shipped CONUS for $425...you send your cylinder first...i ship the kit...Canada add $10 for extra shipping...

if done in my garage add for or bring coolant/oil/filter...about $20

685 installation takes about 4 hours in my garage...a bit more if i need to fix burned/pitted valves...i leak test EVERY head...

wyman

Note to self: Open a new piggy bank for 685.
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Old 04-29-2010, 05:13 PM   #60
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Default Re: Oil Fill Excercise...a must read...lots of pics!!!

So this shows that over 1/2 a litre 500ml is suspended in the engine during operation or running at idle. During my time as chassi engineer with race teams in Europe during the 80's our Engine builders spent as much time trying to keep the oil in the sump of engines. At higher revs the ludricant loose to upper regions of the engine could cause failure from lack of oil because it was all in the valve cover and couldn't get back down in time. Of course when the engine was stripped the correct amount of oil was present and back where it belonged.

Should add I run my 88 Blue 250ml over full that is 2.75 ltrs total with no ill effect to oil temperature during running because I rev the shit out of it 6 to 9000 revs when having a crack, and only run Kmart oil and change it every 1000 miles

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